As you may have heard, Emblems of Heroism and Valor have been phased out in favor of Emblems of Conquest. Everything that used to drop Heroism/Valor badges now drop the latter.
In short, yes, this means that as of 3.2, you can get T8.5 gear by running plenty of Heroics.
Naturally, the elitist are up in arms and furious QQ, the casuals are pleased they can gear up new 80 alts faster, and the intelligent realize that this, in essence, changes nothing.
There’s an attitude I’d like to talk about.
“I’m special.”
Let’s start with the basics. Nearly everyone suffers from this at one point or another, and in a single word, this is called “elitism”.
Some of us suffer from it a lot, some of us just have small, easily squashed inklings of elitism.
Pike over at Aspect of the Hare had a blog post up a while ago that exemplifies what I mean.
Essentially, Pike collected mini-pets long before they were fashionable. She had a random mini-pet button back when most people had a couple pets, tops.
I was different that way, and unique, because I was that willing to give up my bagspace for them. But I was never a collector so much as just a fan.
And then Patch 3.0 and Achievements came out. Minipets became summonable, and fashionable. Even though it sort of bugged me on a minor level that now everybody could and likely would become a minipet junkie, on the other hand the idea of actually having bag space again made me so ecstatic that any potential sadness caused by a loss-of-uniqueness was nullified.
And that, ladies and gents, is elitism in its purest form.
While Pike is nowhere near the level of this current QQ, it exemplifies the attitude.
You had something that was unique, something special. Something you sacrificed for and worked for. Then, suddenly, everyone else has it. You feel sad/bothered/betrayed, as “Blizzard has trivialized your achievements”.
Of course, Pike, being intelligent, recovered rather swiftly from this, and honestly never really felt any nerd rage in the first place.
Let’s get this straight here, Ulduar raiders. You worked hard for your epics. You raided long hours, painfully wiped, had triumphant wins and bitter defeats. You dropped Yogg-Saron before the nerfs, beat Hard Mode X before Y was nerfed.
People being able to get the same level of loot from much easier content in no way diminishes that. It’s all in your perception.
Brutallus being nerfed at the tail-end of BC didn’t diminish the prestige and skill of those who killed him before the nerf. You still beat him when he was hard. You can brag about it later, that you “downed Illidan before the nerfs” or whatever you want.
Nothing, absolutely nothing, can take that away from you. You have achievements now, that come with time stamps, to prove to everyone you downed the hard content when it was hard. You have unalterable, in-game records of your achievements.
And yet, you still complain.
Newsflash: You are not special, and never were.
You can try to say you are, act like you are, but you aren’t. You may be better than the majority of other players, be able to clear the hard content better and faster than 90% of the guilds out there.
How does that warrant your skills being worshiped? How does that warrant keeping the peasants in-line and the grand overlords (namely, you) in positions of, essentially, royalty?
It doesn’t and never will, and it is utterly insane to think for even an instant that it could ever work that way.
An elitist attitude means you want to deny the lesser mortals stuff on sole merit that you are better than they are.
Frankly, this disgusts me on a level I didn’t even know was possible.
I have three sentences for all you egotistical, selfish elitist bastards:
Shut. The Fuck. Up.
Look, PvP gear has worked this way since BC launched. It takes a whole lot of effort to get the current season stuff. Then, when next season rolls around, the current season stuff becomes much easier to get. The skilled PvP players start getting all the new stuff, and those who aren’t as good now have access to the old stuff.
Let’s put it this way. The skilled players are always going to have the best gear. Those with less time or skill are going to have gear, too, but of lesser quality.
That’s how it works, that’s how it always has worked, and that is how it will continue to work.
Amen
To quote The Princess Bride:
Pike gained no power or standing from having minipets in her bag. She just felt special.
Feeling special != elitism.
I doubt she felt that she should have special privileges for having minipets in her bags. And I really hope that she didn’t feel like having minipets in her bags meant she should govern other players.
But I do get what you’re saying
[...] at Critical QQ rants for a while about Tier 8 being made accessible to non-raiders in the next World of Warcraft patch. While I [...]
Ahaha, I love it. Glad you could use me as an example for a post I agree with <3
I heartily approve of this message.
Brilliant, a great post!
Right-o. It will still take -time- to acquire the needed badges, so that isn’t really much different at the core of it. Really, how different is this from buying BOE epics off the AH? Not much, imo.
I like the shut the fuck up bit…
Wait, I’m not a special, unique snowflake?
/cry
[...] over at CriticalQQ covered the attitude thing the best. Basically – you’re not special so quit whining [...]
I’m so quoting that . .
“Shut. The Fuck. Up.” Care of Euripedes.
YES!
[...] Critical QQ on elitism and free T8 [...]
But but but, I have worked so hard to earn Emblems of heroism… what now now you are telling me they are worth the same as Emblems of Conquest… on a T7 level…
Damn… not fair
This actually made me lose a little respect for you. What makes your opinion so much more valid than those who are upset with the changes so you can tell them to “shut the fuck up”? Maybe I don’t like the changes because I see it as condescending and just another way of making me farm old content I’m sick of seeing. Maybe I don’t like it because it removes any sense of accomplishment attached to the gear I receive after the changes (not the gear I have now). Maybe I don’t like it because no longer will my raids feel epic, no longer will I feel like my character is progressing naturally, when she’s in two piece T8.5 and quest blues. Maybe I don’t like it because I feel it’s actually encouraging people to skip content, not experience it, since farming heroics all day will allow you to walk into Uld 10 and have a relatively high success rate.
Maybe I just don’t like being pigeon-holed as elitist simply because I don’t like the changes.
As a raider, I don’t think that I am special or have better skill than non-raider. I have no problem with non-raider getting good gear. But I think that this change make it too easy. You can run Nexus and VH to get 8 emblem in one hour. If you do that for week, you will able to get T8.5. I would prefer that easy heroic drop emblem of Valor and harder heroic (HoL, Oc, UP) drop conquest.
On the other hand, I am happy that my alt can gear up and we can recruit more easily.
I don’t think your comparison to PvP is accurate since people who don’t do arena can only get Deadly set but not Furious set.
I understand to a degree why this is being done. Makes it easier to recruit new people, allow friends in different progressions to raid together, close the gap up a little bit.
At what point though does Blizz decide to just do away with gear and turn this into a Left 4 Dead / Team Fortress style cooperative play?
If gear shouldn’t be important, an indication of a player’s skill, indication of a player’s experience then what is its purpose? To allow you to progress through content? No, it enables you to skip content. Allow you to farm, quest, or do dailies? No, this can be done in crafted blues.
The people that will benefit from these changes aren’t the casual players. You need hundreds of badges to gear up. That isn’t casual.
These changes are for people who play just as much as “hardcore raiders.” Why haven’t they obtained the gear already?
It could be lack social skills. It could be a lack of player skills.
I just wonder, what motivates this player. Farming badges to make farming badges easier? Someone who wants to “upgrade” to a better guild. Hrm…long comment. Not sure where this is going. Just a lot of thoughts.
I’m of a mixed mind about the changes… I like challenge, I like earning my way, experiencing the content. But I also approve of more people experiencing it. Honestly, though, the player matters more than the gear. The best gear in the game isn’t going to make an unskilled player into a superstar.
I think my feelings could be distilled down to, yes, this is a decent change, BUT it’s coming too soon after Ulduar’s release… they should have waited perhaps 3-6 months yet.
And no, I’m not crying about it. Heck, I’ll take full advantage of it if the item in question is an improvement on my current gear, but yes, there is a diminishment factor in this that cannot be dismissed simply as elitism.
Now, just to define where I am, I haven’t even seen Yogg yet, heck, I havent even gone downstairs yet. We currently sit at 9/14, and we’ve worked hard to make that and will continue to progress, nerfs or no nerfs. I wear only 2 pieces of Ulduar gear, and I’m fine with that. More will come as we progress.
So, yes, good idea, but implemented too soon imo.
@ Angry Raider
Pike’s example was intended in a similar vein to, say, demonstrating a solar eclipse with a flashlight, a golf ball and a soccer ball.
Nowhere near the actual thing, but a reasonable representation thereof.
@ Bellwether
Nothing, in fact. They are entitled to their opinion, and I am entitled to my own, rage-filled one.
This wasn’t aimed at everyone who has an issue with these changes. This was aimed at… well, the elitist who have already done all this content, fought for the gear, and are screaming like little children when they think their accomplishments are being taken away from them.
@ PP
I think it holds up under that analogy.
Consider, as you said, those who don’t do arenas don’t get Furious gear, but they do get Hateful/Deadly stuff.
Now consider how raiding here will be.
Those who don’t do the high-end raids don’t get Tier 9 gear, but they do get T7/T8 stuff.
@ xabbot
Gear hasn’t been an indicator of a player’s skill since it was possible to drag someone, or multiple someone’s, through content.
One can learn far more from how/if their gear is enchanted/gemmed and how they are specced.
@ STFU fans (Obviously NSFW)
Must admit at first I viewed this as another easy button. In reflection, I’m in favor of the change. On my server, I’m quite tired of waiting around 3 hours to get a 10 man group together to wipe because 3 people aren’t geared. Forget about a 25 man.
And not a big fan of the raiding guilds dictate when and where I’m playing. So, to have a decent chance to actually experience the content…this works.
@Euripedes
Which is why I pointed to social skills as a reason for not having gear. Who you know can make a big difference.
Skill has always been something hard to determine in many MMOs.
hmm, i’m tempted to come back to wow after hearing (and understanding) this news. As a student i have no time to run naxx or ulduar, and whilst i’d like to try them out, i couldn’t run it for gear. I would feel much happier playing heroics, and doing the odd 10 man.
I’d also like to point out that i am only 79 and a half, so i have no idea what raids or heroics are like, cause i can’t get on the pc at 11 and game for 3 hrs or whatever.
Although, it seems to me that so long as you can play your class, then you should be fine transitioning from heroics to raids, which is ultimately the only valid complaint that the ‘hardcore raiders’ have (that noobs will run heroics and then turn up to 10 mans and out dps or whatever). I think it is fear that the “elite” players will become so much closer to the rest of the wow population that is fueling this qq.
thoughts?
Well the first question I’d have is, if you don’t have time to run Naxx or Uldar then why does this change make a difference? Will you now have time to run the next raid?
If not then what’s the gear going to do? What’s it proved that you’ve achieved in the game?
You haven’t slayed the big dragon, rescued the fair damsel or anything like that, all you’ve done is go back to the same old content they released 9 months ago and run it repeatedly.
Secondly, how hard are heroics is the question you asked. If everyone is badly geared and has no idea what to do then some of them are hard. If you start playing just when 3.2 hits then you’ll probably be in time for the wave of experienced players to blow through all the heroics though as they get their free epics. After that expect a ghost town like it is right now as few people find them challenging (and therefore fun) to do.
On your last point about
”
, to put in perspective in the same gear others do 2500 dps+
Although, it seems to me that so long as you can play your class, then you should be fine transitioning from heroics to raids, which is ultimately the only valid complaint that the ‘hardcore raiders’ have (that noobs will run heroics and then turn up to 10 mans and out dps or whatever). I think it is fear that the “elite” players will become so much closer to the rest of the wow population that is fueling this qq.
”
Nope, I’m in a casual guild and we have some really really bad players, one of them we had was pulling 600 dps in a naxx10 raid, we’ve dragged him through most of it now and he’s hitting 1200 dps so still awful
So having the gear and no idea won’t make a bad player any good, true though that hardcore raiders will be much closer to more casual players since they’re all wearing the same gear now, but real top notch players are in a league of their own. One such guy in our guild wears some blue/crafted epics but hits 3000 dps consistently, he spends most of his time on his main in a top guild though.
i feel, that kniowing how to play your class involves gearing smartly, and getting what is required to up your dps, and hit the raid boss or whatever. That player you are referring to DOES NOT know how to play his class, as he is very obviously lacking hit, if you are indeed correct in that then he has the same gear then he truly doesn’t know how to play his class. I feel that you have completely misread what i said in regards to that, and if you haven’t then i believe you are the type of player i am referring to as “elite”. LET me make it COMPLETELY clear, that i think that a very good player doesn’t have to say that he is hardcore, and probably lets his gear speak for itself. I don’t believe that the hardcore players think that players on the “lower” end will EVER challange them in a raid. But let me tell you that if they win, then that player needs to work on their technique. In this sense, this change will make the really good players work much harder, and become much better.
When i referred to not knowing how heroics play, then obviously , the following “i can’t get up at 11 and game for 3 hrs” was a reference to raiding, i also wanted this to be pointed out.
I also said that i can’t consistently make the raids, but i wish to experience more of the game, and most of that (even the odd 10man) is very hard to access for a person with such time constraints as myself.
I believe Euripedes was referring to you as he wrote this post.
ps 2500 aint that great, so the gear must be crap.
sorry, just read the rest of your post, and noticed this as well :
real top notch players are in a league of their own. One such guy in our guild wears some blue/crafted epics but hits 3000 dps consistently, he spends most of his time on his main in a top guild though.
someone who is dedicated to getting the blues and epics and hitting 3000dps is someone that i would consider able to play his class.
Remember that tokens can only buy you certain pieces of gear, and that the rest of the gear is still quite a significant part of “top dps”
the player that you referenced is not exactly looking top notch on his alt, but his knowledge of the class and dedication is what is giving him those pretty numberswhich makes him someone “who knows how to play his class.”
PS please remember that knowing your character’s limits is integral to your knowledge of your class, (ie, someone who is not ready for raids is someone pulling 0-1500 dps and it is easily remedied by having the inclination to go out and buy some crafted stuff that will serve you into raids)
One of the major issues I have with this is that people are already whining about the game being too easy. That’s not just hardcore elitist players by the way – that’s most everyone. So, as a response to this ‘it’s easy, we’re bored, yadayadayada’… Blizzard makes it easier to get gear? What the hell? Now you can do things the easy way, and hopefully the shiny loot will distract them from the fact they are bored out of their brains.
I can not perceive of a reason why people would or should want to be geared past their current content. The best reason I have heard so far is that they ‘might want to raid occasionally, but don’t have the time to join a raiding guild’. Well, I’m sorry, but you can’t have your cake and eat it too. Either suck it up and realise you aren’t going to outgear the content you spend the most time in, or look for a raiding guild. Hell, there’s raiding guilds out there that raid a very short time each week (see: Anna), so it’s not like there are NO options out there.
For PvP, it makes a little more sense to me. The ‘lifespan’ of gear is short, and you are competing against people with the best gear. Each season brings progressively better geared opponents. In PvE, the lifespan of gear is longer, and you are competing against content which doesn’t get better geared with every season. A boss isn’t going to suddenly hit harder in Naxx because there’s better gear in Ulduar available. If you are raiding Ulduar… then you have access to the gear in there. This seems solidly aimed at the people in T7/Heroic level content… why do they need to over-gear the content?
Just my 2c, of course!
“I can not perceive of a reason why people would or should want to be geared past their current content.”
I’d like to see more content not the same content I’ve already seen. The problem is to access more content you need groups where everyone has the same goals.
so our choices to see more content are: 1. get better/better players, or , 2. leave our guilds for more progression oriented guilds 3. acquire better gear to overcome people’s ability
2 is not acceptable for most of us
1 is not acceptable for the same reason. How many times has a leveling or casual guild tried to start raiding, and it imploded in drama. Guilds whose focus is not raid progression simply can’t afford to discipline and regulate their players in the same way, it destroys those guilds.
Sure I can get better, but the guy in my guild who is my best friend in real life, he does not read shot rotations or strategies – even when I email them to him – he does not have the time. So no matter how much better some get, they are held back by him and others like him. Trying to get him and others to do what it takes to beat Uld is pointless, they are not interested. We don’t mind carrying him and others with us, so some of use are overperforming and some underperforming.
Of course the obvious thing is that we can only progress so far like that. Then what? As I said above the only choices before us are: Use some sort of discipline on the “bad” players which would eventually mean the breakup of the guild or leave the guild and join a more progression oriented guild. Or of course just quit.
That is the choice 90% of the playerbase has. And we don’t want to leave our friends, or antagonize them trying to force them to do what it takes to beat the harder content. We’ll never beat that harder content in our current guilds. But the only choice left is quit out of boredom.
So blizzard does the next best thing, allow us another way to gear up ourselves and our friends, so we can see more of the content. In the meantime, the people who got there first, who are willing to do what it takes to progress faster, they get a new dungeon just for them, which again my guild might never step into. Until Icecrown, when Icecrown is the new tough dungeon, and the coluseum will be nerfed.
So yeah, it will get easier, but so what, everyone else that wanted to do what it takes to beat the hard stuff will have already done it by then. And they’ll have something new to work on.
I find it infinitely frustrating that people expect to see the content without joining a ‘progression guild’. you should not be able to see content merely because you have been handed the gear on a platter.
So, you have mates who clearly can’t play the game worth a damn. Well, THOSE are the people that make the rest of the playerbase mad. Why should a game have to cater for people who can’t play just because it is an MMO? Single player games don’t work that way – you either succeed or you don’t. The game isn’t going to suddenly half way through go ‘Oh, I’m sorry you suck, here, have something which will make it easy for you to beat me!’
Besides…. since when is seeing content ‘fun’ when you overgear it? By getting ‘Ulduar quality’ loot, you really should overgear most of the raid (let’s be honest here… it’s not especially hard for the most part to begin with). Yay for ezmode downings? Then you just run into the same wall over and over, and it doesn’t fix anything in the long term.
yes, wery strange idea of Blizzard, i so only one god thing in it that there are only two t8 peaces to buy, the rest you must roll youreslf:P No more EoH??? how de hell i will buy my scarlet rubys now
@salandor oh, you can trade the badges for the old badges, so you can still buy gems… at least that worked out.
“This seems solidly aimed at the people in T7/Heroic level content… why do they need to over-gear the content?”
This. Plus what Bellwether has said.
I have no doubt that some people are just screaming for the hell of it, but I think it’s quite unfair to be branded as “elitist” just because we don’t like or agree with these changes.
As has been said, it trivialises content even further, and people WILL go to the lowest common denomiator. Why bother wiping on a hard raid boss when you could farm 2-3 Heroic runs of badges in that time? With 2 bits of T8.5 being available from badges, and another 2 from VOA, this means that you can be sporting your 4 piece Tier 8.5 without ever stepping foot into Ulduar. Are we saying now that we shouldn’t bother with progression, and people who ding 80 “deserve” to skip straight to the “bleeding edge” of endgame raiding?
Yes there is more gear than just T8.5, but consider that most classes can also get crafted belts and boots (for which the mat price will decrease significantly when Runed Orbs are common as muck) which can be BiS until hard mode loot – plus the Emblem necklace – I’d say that amount of gear is omre than enough to skip Ulduar and go onto whatever the next raid is.
And I do think we can flip this the other way around. You say the “hardcore” feel entitled to keep their loot and sense of achievement, but what then gives so-called “casual” players the right to expect the same without working for it? And going back to the first quote, if these players still never intend to do raiding, why do they need T8.5? How is overgearing and steamrolling easy heroics going to improve the game?
Anyway, imo it’s not “casual” players who are the problem, or who this is really aimed at (as someone earlier says, casual does not mean you don’t and can’t raid), imo it’s of most benefit for the lazy players who expect epics on a silver platter.
As for gearing alts, I have a better solution for that. Make all emblems bind to account.
How about alts? How about people who want to play with their friends, but have only just reached level 80? Should they have to spent weeks farming Naxx and Ulduar before they can hit the Colosseum? Sounds reasonable to me. What if your guild suddenly needs a new class and you’ve got the body willing to fill that role, but oops! They’re two tiers behind in content that nobody runs anymore. Too bad, guess you can’t play anymore.
How about raiders are a bunch of bitchy babies? Somehow people having the same thing as you makes you cry. They didn’t work as hard for it! When I got my Raven Lord, which I ground like crazy for in BC and never saw even once, I ran around town just excited to have it. There was a druid who I’d always seen on one in front of the bank, usually acting like a douche with Winterfall fire water and other size increasing buffs. As soon as I showed up on my newly minted Anzu he IMMEDIATELY switched to Baron Rivendare’s mount.
I think the question is always going to go back to the original post: why does someone else having the same thing as you diminish your accomplishment? Why does the gear even matter at all? I know it’s the internet and OPINIONS CAN’T BE WRONG, MAN, but I think if you’re raiding for gear instead of gearing to be able to raid, you’re doing it wrong. I can’t think of a more joyless process than running content over and over again not because you enjoy it, but because you want virtual clothing with +numbers on it. If the blood, sweat, and tears are all that matter to you then your opinion vindicates itself. YOU did it when it was hard, and how easy people had it after you has no relevance on your accomplishments. If all you care about is gear, which pretty much means you actually hate playing the game then I think you need to reevaluate your priorities.
Finally, people are acting like this is a criminal thing when really it doesn’t change anything ever. Yes, they will be able to turbo farm for gear from the LAST TIER. OMG! It’s not fair that they can just waltz into T8 when I had to… work… really hard at it… four months… ago… hey what tier are we in right now? It’s not fair how they can run nine days of dailies to get a necklace! I had to work really hard at downing one boss to get that necklace! I hate these stupid scrubalubs! They’re running WoW! Pay attention to ME Blizzard! Pay attention to ME ME ME ME ME. It’s not enough that a raid instance is the highlight of basically every patch, and what the majority of content changes are geared towards, EVERYTHING IS ABOUT ME. ME ME ME.
What gear you are ‘posing’ in matters less and less these days. Character titles are more important if you are showing off your leetness: Twilight Vanquisher, Immortal, Hand of A’dal, Salty and so on.
Back in Vanilla WoW, if you saw someone in T2 or even D2, that was kind of awesome.
You knew they had worked hard for their gear, or at least put in a lot of raid time. They had stuff you could only dream of, even if you were wiping on Baron geddon every week.
Also, that gear was going to be around for a long time, and was seen as the pinnacle of achievement.
Nowadays, we are barely into Ulduar time-wise, and yet people are already talking about T9, so what worth has T8 got anyway? Not much; it’s already seen only as a stepping stone to something better.
There are more people with a T7.5 set than ever had the T5 complete, that I will guarantee, even if I have no statistics to back it up.
Kudos to anyone who got T5 or T6 complete before the big nerf. As for T7 and T7.5, there isn’t any kudos, I’m afraid, it’s standard fodder for average raiders.
agreed.
It never ceases to amaze me how people complain about a GAME being too easy or that achievements in a GAME all of a sudden have less “value.” It’s not like you are going to list all the raid bosses you took down pre-nerfs on a real life resume. Going to have that emblazoned on your tombstone?
Our guild is slow and if a fight requires movement and coordination, it will take us forever to beat that boss. I have yet to see anything pat Auriya on 25-man. So what? We raid…we wipe…the guys hit on the girls…the girls hit on the girls…we have fun.
In the end, it’s just purple pixels on a screen. Why does anyone care? In the grand scheme of life, a GAME doesn’t mean squat.
Slightly off topic, but I had to comment: a “GAME”, huh? Sure its just a game…but so is football or baseball or basketball or golf. I’d be willing to bet that there are thousands of job applicants out there who put “Captain of Varsity Soccer Team”, or “Junior Golf Champion, Age 16″ on their resume’s.
But because we don’t get paid to play, because we are both players AND fans, our achievements are worth less than a sports player?
If I was a guild leader of a progressive raid guild, damn skippy I’m gonna put that puppy on my resume. When my boss asks me what it is, I’ll tell him about the countless hours, blood, sweat and tears that kind of thing can entail – all without getting paid.
If I can do that for a “GAME” and no money, sure as hell I’m going to do even better for money and a “JOB”.
Sorry for the mini-rant.
Clarification: I don’t rate what I do in World of Warcraft as particularly earth shattering.
Having fun in the game and being “good” at the game are two different concepts – sometimes they go together, sometimes not.
I’m not saying that we should ever get paid to play (cos then it would be work).
I also do not rate what sports people do as particularly earth shattering.
But their game gets to go on their resume…go figure.
I think they’ve moved to far the other way. I think sure it’s nice to lose the super tiered approach for those of us that have the skill to raid but not the time or the guild membership.
BUT, I think they should still tier them to Naxx dropping Valor and Ulduar dropping whatever.
Or perhaps releasing it so that we 10 man raiders can get the 25 man stuff through tons more emblems. Or the Heroic folks can get T7 through emblems, but again more emblems required.
I see this as an easy way for a raid that needs another whatever to take the player and not the long long naxx gear grinds.
Might have been more palatable to more folks had they left some tier in the system.
This closes the gear cap between my alts and that makes me happy. I’ve seen tier 8 content on my shaman and will have yogg down before the next content patch so why should I worry about these changes? This is a gear reset mid patch to help new or alt characters gear up quickly to catch up to the next 2 tiers of raiding.
This also gives you elite players more bragging rights that it is all about the skill…. not the gear.
[...] For another take on this check out the Greedy Goblin, ThinkTank and Critical QQ. [...]
@ Saresa – As for why us more-casual-types may want to get hugely improved gear we don’t “need”, my guess is that it is to give us a tangible goal. All I ever run is Heroics and Naxx10, so I have like 123958016235346 EoH sitting around and nothing to do with them because I have geared myself up with them as much as I can and sent milliions of Heriloom items to my alts. For this reason, I’ve become rather at a loss for what to do with my main, I don’t really have any new goals.
With the badge change, maybe I’ll have motivation to run stuff again… sure I’ll probably never need to use the gear, but it’ll give me some good tangible goals to aim for
To be fair though, in a way, I think it would make more sense if they dropped EoH for EoV and staggered it that way. But hey, I really don’t have a preference either way honestly… I am not that picky
“For this reason, I’ve become rather at a loss for what to do with my main, I don’t really have any new goals.”
exactly. I dont’ want to leave my friends, so what do I do? No point in paying $15 a month for a chatroom. I am so bored sometimes I think of canceling my subscription.
And THAT is the reason blizzard is doing this. same as they did it back in TBC. Because blizzard doesn’t want people like us to quit and stop sending them money.
Sure, people are being “handed” stuff in a way, but so what? The measure of skill has never been in gear, it’s been in achievements and dates, now the game even record those achievements.
Gear is now relegated down to the level of “tools”. Not an achievement, just a tool.
No one that needs to farm heroics for badges will ever be able to feel the way the guilds that beat yogg before them do. No one can take that feeling away, so why are some of those people upset? They have something I never will, I’m happy for them.
Just wanted to say that this site has some extremely entertaining articles, which are very well written. I just have one eensy weensy complaint: sentences like this one burn my eyes: “And that, ladies and gents, is elitism in it’s purest form.”
“It’s” = “it is” (and sometimes, “it has”): it’s a contraction, the elision of letters indicated by the apostrophe. “Its” is a possessive pronoun. We must use them correctly and distinguish between them, or the world will fall apart. It’s true!
Oh, and that was an example of grammatical elistism in its purest form.
I like this change for several reasons:
1. Gearing my alts.
2. Gearing new guild members.
3. Gearing non core guild members.
However, I think dropping Emblems of Conquest from everything over simplifies the process. I’d much rather see a system where you keep the current badge drops, and make a trade up:
2 EoH = 1 EoV
3 EoH = 1 EoC
2 EoV = 1 EoC
I don’t think feeling special or different makes you an elitist. An elitist feels special and puts others down for not having those special items. They don’t just think they have something special, they think it actually makes them a better player than someone else. They lecture and talk down to others who don’t have those items.
I’m not happy about the change in emblems, but for another reason. Many players are elitist, but it has nothing to do with their items. Many just think they are better than everyone else. I’ve had players brag about their amazing dps and how they were going to show me how it was done, only to come in last on the meters. Giving these jerks a leg up bothers me.
But my mage has barely gotten to run Naxx25. She can’t find anyone to run heroics with on my server. Most are no longer interested in heroics as they have been 80 for many many months. So I realize that not only is Blizzard making it easier for some to get gear, they are also making those who aren’t freshly 80 want to run heroics again. Otherwise they never would.
And by the way:
“An elitist attitude means you want to deny the lesser mortals stuff on sole merit that you are better than they are.”
But you are saying in another sentence that we want to deny them based on the fact that we worked hard and they are just being handed this. This doesn’t mean that I or anyone else thinks they are better.
I know this isn’t real life, but if my company hired someone who just got their degree and automatically promoted them to my level, I’d be pissed. I’d feel like I had done all that work when I could have just sat on my ass and gotten the same result. This doesn’t mean I think I’m “better” than them. It means I think the company didn’t appreciate me or take my efforts into consideration. It doesn’t mean you are judging the person, it means you are judging the company and in this case, it’s Blizzard.
Like I said in my other comment, I’m just happy I’ll be able to run heroics on my mage again. Oh wait, but I’ll want those emblems on my main too. Hmm. So this still doesn’t help me gear my alt that much. Plus, when all the jerks who just want a quick run look at my mages gear, they’ll dump her from the group and find someone with Naxx25 or Uld gear.. for a heroic of all things!
I guess I’m mixed on this. I’m more upset by the Paladin changes since that is what my main is.
For the longest time, back in the olden days of WoW, on my Orc Warrior I wore Lightforge Spaulders. It was hilarious, people would say stuff, and my guild would joke with me.
I would say I was an Orc Pallie, and use bandages to heal people.
Being the Orc Paladin back in the day…that made me Elite right?
Ok at least “special”
People take this game, and themeselves way to seriously sometimes. Personally I like the change, actually wish there was a way to upgrade tokens, like 2 Valor for one Conquest.
It’s not about feeling better than someone. It’s about giving people something they didn’t earn because they whined and complained that it was “too hard”.
I really don’t have a problem with the changes. There are only a few pieces that can be attained with badges anyway.
I would like to see Blizzard add a level of attunement to raids again. It would be a small seperation between the raider and the average Joe. It wouldn’t be much, but maybe enough to make a raider feel like a raider again.
I am a casual raider, if there is such a thing. One of my proudest moments was getting attuned for Kara. It made me feel like I accomplished something. I was not better than anyone else, but I did what it took to qualify for the next level of the game.
This made my day. Preach it, brother!
Thanks for the rant, Eury! I have left 2 guilds due to the elitist attitude of the officers. There are good players, average players and bad players. As people, they are all equals playing a video game for different reasons and enjoying it in their own way.
Blizzard does a decent job of helping the “spare time” players get some decent epics. In no way does it actually hurt the hard core, 25-man, 5 days a week raider. If you are all about the loot, well, we all have an opinion about that…
My characters all have 100+ EoH collecting dust, even after the dual spec spending spree. The trade system brings some playability back to those characters and it will help the enchant/gemming economy.
HAHA!
Here’s why I love this change.
I play tons of wow…
In increments of about an hour or so. Do you know how difficult it is to raid anything with about an hour to two hours of playtime in a given sitting? Oh you don’t? Well it’s damn near impossible. This has in a sense forced met o PVP. I can PVP and arena in an hour or two and still be ok.
I think this is a good change. I’ll probably never see uldar simply because even after I’m geared IT”S TO DAMN LONG. I can hit a heroic or two a day and still get decent enough gear so that SOMEDAY when I hve a chance to sit for 8 hours I can actually take a stab at it, rather than having some time and not being able to do stuff because I’m woefully undergeared.
Hell where it not for my consistent pestering of my guild to get me into Naxx when DPS dropped I’d never have any nax gear either, but a pug here and a KT fight there and I’ve at least had the opportunity to see the content as well as roll and win on some gear.
All the QQ about being to easy is just that QQ.
Why should it matter how someone got their gear?
If you find yourself getting upset because now people who can’t devote 4-9 hours a day to raiding are getting some good gear you need to:
a. Get a life
b. get a grip on reality.
c. Shut. The Fuck. UP
/4 LFG CHAIN HEROICS
@Bellwether
/agree
[...] Krizzly has a great post on his blog..Also Euri has something as well to say about it. It made me think. Where do I fit into this MMO world I am a part of. I am no hardcore player, I [...]
Couple of points:
(wall o’ text warning)
1: Tier gear is crap for a lot of classes, no better than a random mix of same zonelevel epic drops because the set bonuses blow. So, aside from e-peen issues, who cares about tier stuff?
2: The difference between Heroism purchased tier bits and Conquest purchased tier bits (for the whopping 2 pieces you CAN buy) really just isn’t that meaningful. So who cares?
3: Heroics and 10 man Naxx are “easy” (according to the hardcore), but neither prepares you for Uldaur. Gear, purchased with badges or otherwise, isn’t going to make crap players magically able to succeed in Uldaur. So why would end-game players care about “easy” access to T8?
4: Naxx 10 gear, in sufficient quantities, “trivializes” Heroic content already. So, why would anyone care about a slight scaling of the degree of trivial that the badge change represents?
You care because you ain’t special no mo’ Pfft! Get over it. Let the latecomers enjoy their pointless new shinies, and go back to mauling Yogg for fun and profit.
[...] at Critical QQ wrote a post on monday that Hatch at Escape Hatch (among others) found very provoking, while others read behind [...]
[...] Critical QQ has a good QQ-slapping take on the emblem changes in Patch 3.2. [...]
I like you. Never stop. ^__^
I agree with this completely, and the thing you forgot to mention is that just because you are in a guild that has progressed does not mean you are any more skilled than a player that hasn’t matched that progression.
I bet dozens of guilds carry subpar players, or players that have attitudes. I know I can DPS just like the big boys in Ensidia or other top 100 guilds, but I’m not as geared as they are and I’m not in their guilds, so naturally I don’t get equal gear, recognition or the ability to really shine. But I still love the game and heal/DPS to the best of my class’s ability.
And in the end, you are right, those guilds that can progress, will progress and the things they are complaining about will go away and be replaced by complaints of bugs, ‘too hard’ bosses and content being not what they expected. Get over it, Blizzard plays the game too and they enjoy what they’ve made so it IS good.
Personally, I’m happy to be able to access some of the gear that just flat out WONT drop for my guild
Im just wondering if there will be an exchange system for old Emblams of Heroism and Valor to the new Conquest ? Would hate to see the hundreds i’ve accumulated (due to a lack of anything better than nax 10 gear that can be purchased with them) to go to waste or anything….
This is a change which was perplexing when it was first published but I think with the speed at which content is now being delivered probably will serve its purpose.
I fully agree with the comments regarding elitism. The people who are more interested in progression aren’t concerned about the changes. The people ‘up-in-arms’ are those folk who like to sit around in capital cities all day long and pretend that they possess something significant to the on-lookers.
I consider myself rather casual and yet had seen all but 2 bosses in Ulduar a few days after it came out. I also possess very little Ulduar gear and no tier pieces but have raided it many times.
I play a lot less now and will welcome the chance to get some gear so can again feel competitive on whatever toon i choose to play.
Great post.
[...] Critical QQ has a good QQ-slapping take on the emblem changes in Patch 3.2. [...]
[...] Critical QQ has a good QQ-slapping take on the emblem changes in Patch 3.2. [...]
As someone else said . . . amen.
Although . . . do you mean elitist, or selfish?
I play on 2 servers, in small guilds on both. On the one, the guild has enough people to field two 10-man Naxx/Ulduar groups. On the other, my guild literally doesn’t have the bodies to do that content, so I end up pugging stuff. Ironically, my mainly-pugs toon has Naxx 25 gear, and my two “raid toons” on the other server have T7 sets. I have not been able to get into Ulduar on my better-geared toon, and may not be able to unless I apply to a harder-core guild.
However, think of those of us who are in this boat, first off. This change may be the only way we can gear ourselves enough to GET into the T8 content. Some pugs are quite selfish, and make sure your gear implies you won’t want drops before they’ll let you in. Having access to the T8 gear (via emblems which drop from “lower” content) gives me a chance to gear up to SEE that content. Gear is the measure of a toon, to paraphrase? Really? I’ve been given really, really stupid instructions by members of my toons’ classes with T8.5 gear so . . . I really think not. Depends on your goals.
Oh, and isn’t this emblem change coming with the advent of T9 gear? Won’t all these super-elites have T9 gear like, instantly, just to show us all how uber they are? Or is a level playing field, however fleeting, really that infuriating?
–Stuart
80 Alliance Holy Pally
80 Alliance DK
80 Alliance Resto Shaman
I don’t mind the change. What bugs me is that it is coming too soon for me. I’ve killed 4 bosses in ulduar 10 and 1 in ulduar 25. Our guild is a bit slow but we do progress eventually.
But it seems as though we have 2 months to clear ulduar before Blizz nerfs it and/or overgears us. At that point it doesn’t feel so much like I’ve worked hard to achieve something difficult. It’s nothing to do with feeling elite it’s about the extra enjoyment of doing something that is difficult and eventually succeeding.
I really don’t care how many folks are wandering around in better gear than me. What I care about is finding a balance of difficulty and reward that make me enjoy the game more. There is something satisfying about struggling and succeeding even when I know that there are better players (elite players even) who will get there faster.
But in order to sell more copies of the game Blizz needs to make sure anyone can see everything and quickly because most folks don’t have the attention span to spend much time struggling.
You may be better than the majority of other players, be able to clear the hard content better and faster than 90% of the guilds out there.
How does that warrant your skills being worshiped?
The question has never been whether people who excel should be worshiped. It used to be: Should they be the only people who can see end game content? Not apparently it’s: should they get anything at all.
(I say *they* btw, because I have never been one of them. I didn’t raid in vanilla, and I’m raiding 10 man Ulduar now. Let me tell you, it’s a little hard to get excited about tier 8 when you know that Blizzard is about to start handing out 8.5 to people who’ve never seen Naxx).
I think it’s ridiculous to act like there is something *wrong* with wanting to be able to distinguish yourself with your gear. We are playing a video game. It has some competitive aspects. We are playing a social game with a virtual economy. So, things have value because they show people what you’ve done and because of their rarity.
Achievements are nice, but since WoW is an RPG, people have the expectation that playing their character will actually make that character more powerful in-game (either via leveling or collecting gear). Maybe Blizzard is turning away from that mechanic completely at the level cap and will just reset gear every time an instance comes out, but that’s a fundamental change in how the game works. I for one like the idea of progressing through content and preparing for the next tier by collecting loot in the current one.
Obviously, we need some kind of happy medium here. People shouldn’t be kept from raiding just so the uberleet can feel more special, but people who work hard to play the game well should be rewarded, and should be allowed to enjoy that reward, at least for a while.
@Denezon: No
@Denzor
Sorry for butchering your name.
As much as these changes are unfair a lot of QQ could of been avoided by simply having attunment for raids once more.
I’d just like to say, upfront, thanks a ton, everyone who’s commented so far.
While I do enjoy comments like “Haha that was hilarious” or “amen”, those types of comments don’t stimulate me, intellectually.
This post was, while fueled by nerd rage, intended to spark discussion and provoke as much controversy as possible.
Which it has done admirably.
It’s just far more interesting when people disagree with me.
@ Saresa
I’ve never bought into the whole “WoW is easy” thing. WoW is just as hard as ever, it’s just most of it’s players are better at it.
Consider that it took the world’s top players two hundred and four tries to down the game’s hardest content.
That is NOT indicative of an easy game.
@ Shrubbery
You probaby missed my comment on the matter, but my english education on the whole “it’s” “its” thing was a complete clusterfuck.
One year I was taughtl that “it’s” was only ever used for “it is”, then the next I was taught to use it to denote possession, and so on.
From grade 3 onwards, I was taught something completely different from year to year.
Result being, I get them confused often.
Feel free to keep pointing out my grammar errors… god knows I need to get an editor sometime for my shenanigans.
@ Melissa
But they aren’t promoting them directly to your level, they’re promoting them directly to the level below yours… then paying them less and giving them a smaller office with worse hours.
@ theerivs
I’m doing the Netherwing dailies on my Paladin, and I’ll tell ya… Orc Paladins are the coolest thing ever.
@ Echo
Precisely.
I mean, if someone who’s never been outside of a heroic instance rolls into Ulduar with all his new shinies, he’s not going to magically apparate the skill needed to raid there.
He’s just going to look cool when he wipes.
@ Stuart
The line between elitist and selfish is nearly nonexistent.
Great article. Keep on sharing
When people talk about raiding through wipes, challenges, skill tests, &c, so many of them talk as though the “reward” for this is the gear that they get. Strikes me that they’re missing out.
My reward is the fun of doing it with my friends. Gear is icing, not the reason for doing it.
Anyone else getting the same gear can’t detract from the fun\adrenaline\laughter I had.
If the only reason (or even main reason) someone plays is to get gear … I feel sorry for them. I my eyes, they’re missing most of the point of playing.
JayBean, you hit the nail square on the head.
What ever happened to just having fun. Who cares if the lower skilled players get gear thqat you are going to be throwing away as you push the next tier? You are still competitive with the new gear if that is what floats your boat. Some of use support smaller groups of fun guilds made of friends doing this for entertainment. We laugh at the wipes over small vent servers, cheer over beating the odds doing 5 man raids with three players. Then we try to pug occasionally. And we get turned away. Because the pug groups want people who have the better gear. So we either quit the guild of friends for a larger guild who might not take us because we don’t have elite gear, or we never see content that you are already ignoring because you are two sets of content ahead.
I don’t see the problem with making the story, and the content more accessible to casual players. As the big guys move up, many don’t ever look back. Should the older content just become vacant and unused? or do we let the casuals have their turn…. The laughter will be grand and the cheers quite laud as we take a shot at what you farmed…
I’ve always thought it would be good if EoV could be purchased with 2 EoH. If they were to impliment something like that, then an EoC could be purchased with 2, 3, or 4 EoV. People could still farm Heroics/Nax for EoH/EoV but it would require more of them to purchase gear outside the content they were farming.
What really bothered me is that 10 Ulduar only drops EoV, yet we couldn’t purchase 2 pieces of Ulduar 10 Teir 8 gear with EoV.
So I’ve been thinking a little more about this, and this is What I came up with.
10 man raids should drop Heroic Emblems of Conquest/Triumph etc. 25 man raids should drop Valorous Emblems of Conquest/Triumph etc.
2 EoH can purchase 1 EoV of the same level, or 1 EoH of the next teir level.
With this system even one of the current 19 EoC items would require 76 EoH. If someone is willing to take the time to farm 76 EoH, or 38 EoV to get a 19 EoC item all power to them.
The was an observation made in an earlier post about people who play long enough to get “hundreds of badges” not being any more casual than raiders. One of the implications being made was that they are less skilled, inferior players, and that allowing them to get T8 gear from badges is a sort of disservice to the “skilled” players. I disagree.
I play several raid worthy toons (DK,Mage,Druid, Hunter). I work for a living and have limited playtime, and although I enjoy raids I dislike the disorganized way in which raids are ran.
In my experience raiding is mostly standing around waiting while people are saying “brb…phone”…or “brb..bio”…or “brb…dog”, etc. When I’m in the mood for group play I prefer to jump in, do our thing, and get it over with without a whole lot of fuss or waiting around. I don’t like being stuck in a raid for 5 hours, I much more enjoy doing 3 or 4 heroics in the same amount of time.
Obviously that indicates I’m a more “casual” player than raider. Yet on the few occasions I decide to raid I’m always at the top of the DPS meters (usually first in 10 mans, usually top 3 in 25 man raids). My gear is generally worse than “dedicated” raiders, but I’m the more skilled player, and it shows.
Any more can be decked out in full iLevel 219 or higher, as long as they grind through the content enough. Acquiring the gear isn’t a measure of skill, it’s a measure of stamina.
@All the QQers:
1) Gear is not the messurement of your eepen anymore. Achievements and date acomplished that achievements are. So stop whining about “your” gear being distributed to the “bads”.
2) Having better gear from someone else doesnt make you a better person. Whining because that someone will have a chance acquiring that gear after you got it and got fed up with it though will make you a worse person.
3) Everyone will have a very good reason now to go back to heroics and Naxx (and ulduar later) with their alts and have some fun AND reward without busting their heads the way we did when we first steped in these instances with greens and quest blues.
4) WoW’s player base is the “bads”/”scrubs”/”casuals” or how else “elite” people of this game want to discribe them. For every IMBA player there are more than 100 of these “casuals”. Blizzard wants to satisfy these customers too. Live with that or just leave the game. This game is not made for YOU. It’s an massive multiplayer game. Emphasize to the massive and the multi part. Focus on these two words and then maybe you will understand whats happening here.
5) As JayBean so nicelly put it, the biggest reward is the social factor of this game. I keep playing because i play with people i like. I dont care if someone with less skill/time/will will achieve what i achieved as long i have some fun with my friends.
I agree with the main thrust of your post and just had a long discussion with an elitist guildie about the very same issue w.r.t. T8 drops off Emalon and stuff like this.
Having said this, I think that it is a mistake on Blizzard’s side. As wow.com pointed out, to get the two buyable T8 pieces, one needs 116 emblems, i.e. 27 heroics, i.e. 3 days (if dedicated and slightly addicted and doing the dungeon-dailies). For the full iLvl 226 outfit (6 pieces) it is 230 emblems, i.e. 5 days. Even given less insanity this means that people can quickly equip to powerful levels since heroics won’t get harder, making it easier for them to beat Ulduar-and-beyond-content.
Which *cannot* be in Blizzard’s interest.
I went through something very similar to this awhile back when Blizz decided to give pallies and locks their epic riding mounts by just training, no longer would you have to do the extended and expensive quest lines for those mounts, just walk up, get trained and bingo epic mounts for all. I thought for awhile that it was a dirty move on Blizz’s part but let’s face it, it’s their game. As stated above it doesn’t take away what you and your buds did to earn the mounts. Blizz will continue to evolve and change so keep what you and your guildies have done with your achivements and be damm proud of what you have done. Others are going to come right behind you on an easier track for the same gear but that in no way diminishes your accomplisments – RANT OVER
Grammar check:
Critical’s article
Vlad’s comment
they show possession.
it’s collar (eg the dog’s collar)
should show possession, but the shortened form has already been used in
it is = it’s
therefore the irregular form
its collar
has to be used instead.
Hope that’s clear !
@JayBean
/agree
The gear that you loot from the boss is the icing, not the cake. Or at least that’s the way that you should be looking at it.
Sure back in Vanilla it was impressive when a T3 geared player walked through Org/IF and the unwashed masses would ooh and aah as they inspected your uber loot. Fast forward through BC to today and with the lower raid caps, and removal of attunements, I think you’d be hard pressed to find anyone that gives two chunks of Kodo excrement what you are wearing while you block the mailbox with your Tundra Mammoth.
My 25 man raid imploded due to some RL absences and a few bad apples 4 weeks ago. So this change will help me to pick up a few pieces of gear and not fall woefully behind the curve while looking for a new 25 man raid. Or I can quickly bring my Paladin up to a level where he can jump a tier, should he be more attractive to a raid than a shadow priest.
Either way, with both characters, I’m just getting the icing, but missing out on the cake. Sure the icing is good, but it is far less satisfying on it’s own. For those that don’t get that, I think you’re raiding for the wrong reason.
I think you’d be hard pressed to find anyone that gives two chunks of Kodo excrement what you are wearing while you block the mailbox with your Tundra Mammoth.
That’s exactly the point*. Gear is going from being exciting for a few people, to being exciting for no one. I can’t see how Blizzard could think that’s a good thing.
(*Well, that’s part of the point. As I said before this seems to also represent the abandonment of ‘progression’ and is a move away the idea that you can make your character stronger by accomplishing things in game.)
@briatx
“That’s exactly the point*. Gear is going from being exciting for a few people, to being exciting for no one. I can’t see how Blizzard could think that’s a good thing.”
I disagree. I would say that gear is going from being exciting for a few people, to being exciting for everyone. I don’t see how anyone can argue that is a bad thing.
Like I said in my original post, I’ll probably benefit from this since I’m not running 25 mans currently. I’ll like having the upgrades, but I’ll miss out on the fun of running content until we get our 25 man group up and running again.
I would say that gear is going from being exciting for a few people, to being exciting for everyone.
I think that’s a better description about what is happening to content. It is inherently interesting and fun, no matter how many people get to see it.
Gear, on the other hand, is only special when it represents something like accomplishment. I want good gear because (a) it shows what I’ve done in game and (b) it makes my character stronger in a relative sense (i.e. it makes me a healer you want to pick for your group over other healers).
Don’t get me wrong, I understand that limiting gear too much limits access to content, and I 100% support the idea of making old gear easier to get when a new content comes out. But this change goes well past that, and basically removes the idea of gear progression altogether. Welcome to 80, here’s your 8.5! (And like I’ve said before, that’s particularly disheartening to someone who is rolling on tier 8 right now. I’m not looking forward to running heroics to upgrade gear I’m getting from raiding the “end game.”)
Dropping valor in heroics / naxx 10 and conquest in uld 10 /25 might have been a better compromise, I don’t know. I do know that Blizzard wants the game to be fun for everyone, and I applaud the changes they have made so far to make the end-game more accessible to more casual players like myself. I just think that with this change, the pendulum is swinging too far in the other direction.
Wow… sorry for all that rambling.
I’m a progression raider, but I’m not gonna QQ about casuals sharing the gear for which I raided. I actually think having easy access to those epics is going to make things harder for the casuals, and I feel kinda bad for them.
Right now, I see a mix of gear checks and achievement checks, but once everyone has ez mode access to the gear, it’s going to be ALL about the achievement checks. Right now, a casual with some decent Naxx epics can get in a pug for maybe 10 Uld or Sarth + some quantity of drakes without having the achievement because the gear shows some knowledge, some raiding experience, some theoretical skill. Once gear is equalized, achievements will be mandatory because they will be the only differentiator, and it can make a vicious circle for casuals….
Don’t have the achievement to get in the run to get the achievement.
The casuals are going to be all dressed up and have no place to go.
I wish I hadn’t wasted my time reading this. I don’t have a position on the topic (don’t even play anymore), but if I were looking to form one, this just adds to the noise.
Case in point: The “Shut The Fuck Up” comment is just substituting invective for anything approximating a cogent argument. Congratulations on forming an opinion on something. On the Internet. Go you! More useful would be someone trying to say something new on the topic.
@Pike – Sorry, I mean nothing personal with the following post, but you’ve been used as a prime example in this argument, so I feel the need to point this out:
You’ve done everything heroic, and bonked Naxx pretty well from what I can surmise from what you’ve said in your post. With the new badges available, you said you would go back to doing the same thing you’ve farmed for the last few months.
Why not experience the new content for the gear you will farm for instead of just running the same old thing over and over?
You claim to be a “casual”(I use quotes because the word has no meaning anymore, people have bastardized the meaning of it), if you have millions of badges(over-exaggerating of course) you must play a significant amount. “Elitists” are arguing this exact point: “Casuals” are going to get gear by taking the easy way out. But these people aren’t really casual, in any sense of the word. They spend hours doing heroics instead of raiding, because heroics are easy. They don’t want the challenge of new content, they just want the easy way out.
Call me an “elitist” if you want, I’m a raider.
Oh and Euripedes, “Shut. The Fuck. Up.” means nothing as 3 sentences, you just sound like a stuttering turrets patient.
I don’t have an issue with heroics/T7 content dropping EoC, but there is something conspicuously absent in this entire discussion: Daily dungeon quests (both normal AND heroic) dropping Emblems of Triumph, the T9 emblem. THIS is not on par with Deadly v. Furious comparison, and it DOES put players on par gear-wise, at least partially, without beating (or even experiencing) the content.
Where have I seen this before… oh, yes… Sunwell badge gear.
Additionally, I think there are too few categories of players in the discussion. It isn’t just “hardcore” and “casuals”. There are a LOT of “casuals” who are every bit as skilled as Top guild members – they just choose not to devote THAT much to it, either by choice or circumstance. There is a third category that I think Stiggie (above) is referring to that should not be counted among the “casual” group, and that is (credit to Gevlon, of “Greedy Goblin” fame) the M&S (morons and slackers).
If there’s anyone I fear getting EoT from daily dungeons, it is them. KarenTKD was spot on: It’s going to be strictly about achievements. Gear will no longer matter when getting into a high-end guild or a PuG group.
“LFM HC UK Must have full T8.5 and [Epic] achievement!”
Be careful what you wish for
Couldn’t disagree more, your entire argument is that everyone should have everything no matter how little skill, ability or effort they put in?
What’s the point, where is the challenge? What have you got left to aspire to? What makes characters in the RPG different?
With that attitude they might as well build an elevator to the top of Everest, sure it’ll be nippy up there but everyone can “achieve” conquering it.
WoW is supposed to be a game, something you play and the better you play (since its also supposed to be a MMO RPG) the better rewards you get.
They have admittedly a fine balancing act to keep allowing new players to join in in between expansions. But instead they’ve just given me (an above average player, but no where near the best) the same rewards that hardcore totally organised raiders work at 24/7 to get and we are no where near the end of the expansion.
How hard do I need to work for this? Not at all, the 5 man “heroics” that drop the gear can all be done when you ding 80, I did them in my middle of the road level 70 epics none the less. This isn’t hard, its not even challenging, just like if they stuck that elevator to the top of Everest it would lose its whole point.
I’ve switched off the high level content now, Activision Blizzard aren’t working hard enough by far for my money here, they’ve just dropped the gear as a big incentive to keep suckers running the same old content over and over without even putting any effort in to make it remotely interesting or challenging.
It depresses me how many suckers out there are lapping this up, heroics drop one ilevel 200 epic and are easily completable before in ilevel 140 gear, now though we’ll be wearing ilevel 229, and yet Blizzard are so lazy that they cannot be bothered to even retune the same old content for the new gear.
The top end game of WoW is just an insanely dull grind at all levels, come on people, vote with your feet and actually make them put out a decent game, this crap effort shouldn’t be gracing a bargain bin.
What confuses me about Bellwether, Garreth, and the other angry people is why they think that the tier pieces are A) a big deal and B) the reason people run Ulduar (or any progression raid).
The tier pieces are fine for people to stand around cities in, but most of the ‘hardcore’ people know to check on weapons, jewelry, and other items because those are where the real boost in power is these days. As soon as Blizzard changed the tiers to 5 items you could tell that this was the model they were working towards. Your class tier is your basic raid ‘kit’, it has powerful stats and bonuses that take you to a minimum level of performance. How you choose to gear the rest of your slots is what separates the experienced from the well prepared from the grinders. Note that I didn’t call anyone a slacker, noob, etc. there are different strokes for different folks and if someone wants to bust their tail to grind out all the badge loot in 3-4 days than more power to them. To me it is no different than our Alt Naxx runs that we do once a week in which an alt of a friend of mine who’s not in the guild came on his DK and soaked up 8 items, including 4 pieces of T7.5, the tanking jewelry, and a weapon in our 3 hour run.
I’m in a casualcore guild, to use Bellwether’s expression and we’ve cleared Yogg and most of the guild is in at least 4 piece T8.5 at this point. We did it on 2-3 raid nights a week, call it an average of 10 hours of raiding a week since we had a few people drop WoW for RL reasons and we missed at least 1 raid a week for about a month and a half. Most of the people I read about that are unhappy about this change have real struggles with raiding and are very attached to the couple tier pieces that they’ve won and are thus defensive about losing their status symbol which ironically isn’t a status symbol to anyone that’s actually progression raiding.
you know whats funny though i havent seen many good guilds or top end raiders that offer to help the people (who recentely hit 80…and have done all the heroics for that gear) get into things like nax/os/vault…most people right now that are running the end game content wont step foot in those anymore unless its with their guild (that is in almost full ulduar gear). so how do you expect people who are just hitting 80 and have the heroics gear to get any better if no one is willing to do the older stuff to help them? while at first you are right you will be carrying them through the stuff some of them will eventually get much better! i for one go to nax and os and the like if they need me because most likely they have people in there that need a good bit of gear…and if we dont help them then how will we ever know if they can be good? what if some of the guys in that group would turn out to be some of the best players and alwas pull top dps if only someone wouldve helped them to get gear/help them out with just useful tips.
i dont know it just seems like people in general are focusing too much on ME and what will make ME happy right now.
also another thing i wanted to say…if you really are a hardcore raider…why does it matter if some gear can be farmed by just doing heroics? it can be farmed by doing the raid too! yes some people will be walking around with the same lvl gear as you (for however fleeting a time with the t9 gear) but if you are a raider then raid! if you dont have time to raid at the moment then i see this as a great opportunity!
p.s. it is just a game!
[...] on about the upcoming Emblem changes in patch 3.2. You can read some of the opinions here and here. Here is my official take on the changes, with a real world [...]
The problem with this change, as many other people have pointed out, is that it’s going to make uludar way less appealing to run.
My guild certainly won’t have all of the hard modes down by the time the patch drops, and you’ll be able to get better emblems by doing the normal daily dungeon quest than running uld 25 hard modes. That’s just silly.
It’s silly because uld is good content, and guilds that aren’t among the uber elite will have to herd cats if they want to get people to keep doing the content and ever try to clear it.
I could care less if non-raiders get good gear, what I care about is dropping that much raiding gear in trivial content will kill our uld progression and we’ll never finish it.
If blizzard really is hell bent on implementing this change, they need to bump uld 10 up to triumph for hard modes, and uld 25 up to triumph for regular, otherwise there’s just far too big an incentive to never walk in there again.
Epic. Awesome. Wonderful.
<>
oops forgot!!!
[Gold Star]
If you want to tell other people how to play the game, take a hike. People who want challenges will find them. I did my epic mount quest on my Pally, even though he hit 60 two months after Wrath came out, and I did it without the benefit of Outlands gear or some 80 friend running me. People who don’t want challenges, well, they’ll roll Death Knights and PVP, or something. Whatever.
If you want a challenge and aren’t getting it, then clearly Blizz isn’t providing, and you should cancel your subscription.
If you want a challenge and CAN’T get it (not through lack of skill or social graces, but, say, because all the raiding guilds on your server are full of assholes and are no fun to play with) and you’re thoroughly bored of the same level 80 5-mans, this stuff should be a boon. Now you can go see raid content in PUGs or in your small fun guild, and still be challenged. Besides, you can always shove your epix in your bank and don worse gear. Be creative.
If you want prestige, fame, glory, and people /inspecting your phat loot, go away. Nobody cares anymore. There’s too much bloat at 80 anyway.
If you want to talk about grammar and pretend that sentence fragments are utterly meaningless, you’d best learn the differences between communication and grammar. Sometimes the best way to communicate is to flout the rules.
@ Gareth
No, my argument is this: Blizzard has already made this change. Bring to bear all the constructive criticism you want, of which there is plenty in this thread.
I take issue with those thousands of raiders who are against this change solely because they think they should be the only ones with access to gear of this quality.
If you’re against it because it ruins progression, or this or that or the other thing, that’s fine, that at least makes sense.
But being against it only because it grants gear to those less skilled than you are?
It’s that attitude this post was directed against.
@ Stiggie
It’s “tourette’s”, by the way.
Don’t try to troll me, unless your intention is to give me a chuckle before I head to work.
Excellent write up.
I totally agree.
WoW, where everybody is a ‘hero’.
You speak of disgust, well this is what disgusts me of this game. What is the point of playing a game if doesn’t matter much whether you’re casually lapping up honor points for gear or raiding hard just to see that gear trivialised at the whim of Blizzard? Rhetorical question btw.
Skill should be worshipped, what is the alternative; not caring about whether or not some players actually put effort into understanding the game and thereby facilitating BETTER and more ENJOYABLE groups for OTHERS? There is nothing elitist about that my good man.
Who in their right mind wants to waste their time on crappy groups, whether PUG or (PUGged) raid and when you confront those noobs with their obvious inadequacy, they can merely churn out “LOL!”, sometimes even followed by “it’s just a game, dude”.
THAT makes me sick to my stomach. Bring back the elitists, at least they make things happen and set the wheels of actual grouping in motion. Lock dungeons behind arduous quest lines with keying et al, so that noobs will never see that content. *Gasp, did he just say that?* YES, I did just say that. I really, really don’t want to be confronted with people who have 0 skill or 0 intent to better their character SKILLwise. It would also be nice if less emphasis was on gear, but that’s just a dream that will never come to fruition in this game. (quite the opposite most probably, as expansions get churned out)
And ofcourse it doesn’t even have to be mentioned but with the WoW crowd, nothing is a given /sigh … so here goes:
PS: Ofcourse, it’s nice when people who are skilled are also not complete douchebags. People who actually like to help out, facilitate knowledge without being a c*nt about it.
I think you’ll find that the elitists Euri is talking about ARE the skilled players who also happen to be douchebags: the guys who have cleared all the raid content 4 minutes after launch and then proceed to tell everybody else how crap they are, without any kind of constructive criticism.
Funnily enough, the people who have that attitude ARE the ones who feel that they should be worshipped for their gear…and that’s what this is all about. “Hey, I have T8.5. Obviously I’m a better person than you, which means that you don’t deserve what I have”.
It is ass-backwards, and supported by the fact that in WoW, we are all anonymous. If someone says to me, “I have a Jaguar and you don’t, therefore I am better than you, thus you don’t deserve the same things as me”, I’m gonna punch him in the throat.
Note (to head off the inevitable picking-apart-of-my-analogy): The badge changes are not the same as me being given a Jaguar like the asshole has. They ARE the same as having the price of the Jaguar lowered so that I might be able to afford one too. Is that wrong?
@Gareth
You’re exactly right, and this is why I stopped playing WoW recently. Wrath raid content is easier than anything before it, overall, but now Blizzard feels the need to make clearing the content optional. Clearing heroic 5-mans or Naxx for Tier 8 makes absolutely no sense.
What is wrong with progression? 5-mans->Naxx->Ulduar progression should be fine, and there are plenty of decent epics earned from the heroic badges and crafting for people who can’t raid.
WoW has never been the hardest MMO, but for many players this game has lost the sense of accomplishment and reward it provided with level 60 raiding.
If this makes me an elitist, well I guess I’m an elitist.
Brilliant! Perfectly shows what I think about it. It’s not that skill is nothing, you still need it, you just shouldn’t believe that it makes you as a person better than others. As a player though, it probably does.
The QQ in here is utterly QQish.
Boo hoo I’m in t8 and now EVERYONE is going to have T8.5 and now no one will think I’m special.
Get over yourself already. You’re in T8 because you’ve spent countless hours pressing 1,2,3 while moving around, NOT because you’re a “skilled” player.
Half the crying in her revolves around delusions of grandeur being smashed and the reality of their insignificance being revealed, and ties back to the original point of ELITISM
You are not elite, you just spent more time getting gear, and not that you spent more time it’s that you spent larger blocks of time.
Let’s all be real honest here, given enough time and the OPPORTUNITY, ANYONE COULD get the gear the traditional way. There is no real accomplishment involved and even if there is the GEAR is not the accomplishment because guess what…out of 25 people in a raid only a few get gear usually. So does this mean that the people who didn’t get a drop on an uldar boss shouldn’t feel like they’ve accomplished something?
If you find that you’re still QQ over this you’re either:
A. Retarded
B. Elitist
Search within yourself to find which you are and adjust accordingly.
/4 LFG Chain Heroics.
p.s.
It’s = It is
Its = Possessive
@ Blackthought
From your tone, I would wager that you have no pre-Wrath raiding experience. Gear aside, many veteran raiders have up and quit (myself included) because Blizzard has simply taken all the fun and challenge out of WoW in order to appease people who claim that they are casual.
The raids in Wrath are EASY and Blizzard still feels the need to hand out free epics like candy. There is something wrong with this picture, but obviously most people don’t like being challenged at all nowadays.
So now we have a player base of pampered individuals who mostly can’t play thinking that they are entitled to easy epics. What’s worse, they act like they are WoW gods the moment they get one or two of these said free epics tossed their way.
Blizzard hasn’t ‘removed’ the fun out of WoW, its functionally the same game that you played and raided in for however long you did. I agree with Euripedes that WoW isn’t any less challenging, I would argue that most of what people perceive as less fun is either burnout or just the simple fact that WoW is aging. A lot of people have been playing WoW non-stop for 4.5 years now, that’s basically a generation when it comes to games.
I’ve been playing since launch, I was one of the early 60′s helping people gear up for MC but due to RL commitments I’ve had to take several long breaks from WoW. I think that’s what has kept the game fresh for me. I don’t think the raid content is any easier, I think the in-game and mod tools have made a lot of the headaches go away (remember setting up for Garr back in the day?)
The one thing I will concede is that almost anyone can get epics these days. But at the end of the day why is that such a big deal? Smart raid leaders know to look at the sum total of a person’s gear, sure you’re not going to look ‘iconic’ standing by a mailbox in your tier items anymore (you really haven’t since even the end of Vanilla) and the people that it might be important to impress with your gear will know that yes, your weapon is BiS from Ulduar and that the rings you got came from Vezax or Algalon etc.
@ Stiggie and people of his ilk.
So if someone is unable to spend 5+ hour blocks of time raiding that means they want the easy way out?
Obviously then the best thing to do is to make ALL raids an hour long, like heroics, VOA or OS. That way hard core raiders can still fight hard stuff and “casual” players who can play for 1-2 hours every day can have a chance at the “hard stuff too”.
I know personally I can’t always invest 6 hours in to running nax. I’d love to finish it all up, ironically enough I have KT down in 10 man and 25 man because I can usually find a group that fell apart at the end, it’s the content in the middle that I’m not privy to because I simply cannot invest 6 hours of time into getting from point A to point B. So what do I do sometimes? I do a heroic. Not because it’s simple, not because I’m lazy, not ebcasue I want something easy, but because it’s all I have time for.
I also pay the samy money you pay to play the game and would like to be able to see all parts of it.
[...] On Elitism and Free T8 As you may have heard, Emblems of Heroism and Valor have been phased out in favor of Emblems of Conquest. Everything [...] [...]
[...] case you missed Euripedes of Critical QQ’s discussion regarding the badge changes, you might want to check it out. Agree or not, there are some interesting points of discussion [...]
@Euripedes
Thanks for the fix.
@Blackthought
If you are spending 5+ hours a day in a raid instance, I’d feel bad for anyone in that situation. Anyone who is spending that much time can’t have much time for anything else, or is sacrificing sleep. Any guild I’ve been affiliated with usually raids about 3 hours a night 2-4 days a week. The key is to find something that can fit your life(I play video games on work nights, and go out on weekends). If you are spending 6 hours in Naxx something is wrong with the groups you are going with, the zone should take 4 hours at max unless people are really unprepared. And VoA is out there, I think it is a very viable way for people with limited play times to get really nice gear for both PvP and PvE. With no wipes, VoA takes what… 30 minutes? That’s less than most heroics.
“There is no real accomplishment involved and even if there is the GEAR is not the accomplishment because guess what…out of 25 people in a raid only a few get gear usually.”
I’m really sorry that you feel that way. It sounds like you’ve been on some really bad PUG raids where you got shafted. I’ve been there, it blows, and it’s why I run with an organized guild now.
“I also pay the samy money you pay to play the game and would like to be able to see all parts of it.”
That wasn’t the point of my post or my question. People are stating that they can just run the same things over and over to get top end gear INSTEAD of running the actual instances they drop in. These people don’t want to experience new content, don’t want to challenge themselves, they just want gear handed to them. I agree with you, you should be able to see all parts of it. But you won’t see them if you keep running the same heroics over and over again.
@ stiggie
While I have been in some really crappy pugs I’ve also been in some very nice guild raids as well as some very cohesive pugs. IMHO guilds make things that much easier and I would advise everyone to join a “game play” appropriate guild, i.e. a guild with the same play hours as yourself (if not then make one). The gear that the “heroic runners” will be able to get will not be top end, it will be “last season”. I think it’s pretty presumptuous of everyone here to assume that people who CAN’T run raids on a weekly basis do so because they don’t want to experience new content…does that even make sense? To want new gear but no place to use it? I mean really how many heroics can you run before you want to smash your head into a wall? I can’t think of one person I’ve met playing WOW that hasn’t wanted to go to the next level. I have met people though who can’t get to that next level because of “gear checks” and certain attitudes towards the guy running nax with a blue on.
As for easy, ok I’ll concede this point. WOW CAN BE difficult and that difficulty generally comes in to play with new content and or seriously under geared people, either way both cases bring difficulty to a raid or an instance. If “challenging” is what you’re after then why is everyone so “gear checking happy?” Wouldn’t it more “challenging” to take 1-2 people into a group that aren’t dishing out UBER DPS, hell if “challenging? Is what you’re after then why not run some of the raid with your fishing pole?
@Shiranai
Actually much like Stormtrail below I was there in vanilla wow, then took a break, came back in towards the backend of BC and have been here for all of Wrath.
What to you made raids challenging? Was it gearing up for them to make them easy? Was it the difficulties of the fight (which I will agree are easier now)? Like I said above, if it’s the gear you feel made it challenging the go in with a NOT BiS equipped and try it that way. Also, if you’re worried about “easy epics” how does that detract from you still feeling a sense of accomplishment when you do get that Uldar BiS, especially knowing that no matter how many heroics a person runs they are not going to get that like you just did?
I think a lot of people forget that OLD WOW was largely difficult because the ENTIRE concept of WOW and raids was new, thus unknown. Now that people have over the course of time developed strategies, tactics, and game plans to help ease the learning curve a little. As a whole WOW has gotten easier I think most people can agree to this, but still end game content has it’s challenges and when it feels like it doesn’t it isn’t because some guy just geared up in Heroics.
The point remains and I’ve not seen a decent answer for it yet.
What does someone else getting an easy epic have to do with YOU and your accomplishment?
In a sad way that’s like crying about 4 80’s going back to a vanilla wow raid and you saying, “that’s no fair when I did it I had to run it with 40 people 6 times to get that piece to drop” . . .
[...] and against are presented all over the place, most notably by Euripedes at Critical QQ, who first lambasted raging “elitist” raiders and then explained himself a little bit better, laying out the more cogent issues behind the pros [...]
[...] said it another way in one of his comments: I mean, if someone who’s never been outside of a heroic instance rolls into Ulduar with all his [...]
I would just like to take pre-credit for my own sentence back in March, “Suck. It. The. Fuck. Up.” lest it gets confused with this blog’s gem! ( http://underct.com/2009/03/ )
I know how to pick out the important parts of a blog post!
I approve
From the tone of the posts, sounds like the whole “New Content” argument is moot.
More is being mentioned about the Tier 8.5 –> whatever Tier Blizz comes up with next…
This is IMO what the QQ’rs are whining about.
They don’t care about the content or lore, once all the bosses are downed, thats it.
Its not about them not wanting to let casual gamers see the end content, they just don’t want them to look identical to them in game.
Sooo what Blizz should do to make both sides happy is this:
Keep Tier 8.5 looks and stats as they are now.
Make tier 6 or tier 7.5 gear exactly the same stats as T8.5
there you go. problem solved. Now the QQ’rs can’t whine about free T8.5 epics, coz they are not, then these casuals can go on and clear the content just to see it and enjoy the game for what it really is…a form of escapism and stress-relief.
[...] otherwise you’re pretty obviously not getting into the whole crab thing properly.” Critical QQ has a good QQ-slapping take on the emblem changes in Patch 3.2. World of SnarkCraft has published part one of Learning to Weigh [...]
Players who do content that is eaiser than Ulduar shouldn’t be allowed to get Ulduar level gear from it.
As a lower guild, what’s the point of getting upgrades from Naxx bosses if you can just stockpile badges and get iLevel stuff which is much much better.
It’s not about elitism or the feeling you’re better than everyone else. It’s about you get the appropiate rewards for doing the appropiate content. Back in the day you couldn’t get Naxx gear from farming MC, and you never should have.
This is a change you would see near the end of the expansion, like the 30% hp nerf.
Why have a tiered badge system to begin with if you will just won’t use it anymore.
You’re all stupid. Blizzard knows full and damn well that content gets abandoned. Once the “good” players move on from content, how the HELL are you supposed to get past the content if you can’t support it with your gearset?
Consider: Paladin tank X has the same EXACT skills as Paladin tank Y, but Paladin tank X has 25K HP unbuffed and Paladin tank Y has 35k HP unbuffed. Well, currently Paladin tank X is completely fucked: NOBODY raids naxx 10 anymore, nobody lets a tank of that gear level tank Naxx 25, most people are farming ulduar and you’re not letting him in there either. So, how the fuck is Paladin tank X supposed to progress?
He isn’t.
Enter Blizz: O HAI, WE UPPED YUR G34R LVLS, SO YOU HAVE A CHANCE ALSO, BECAUSE U CANT LINK ACHIEVEMENT FOR ULDUAR SO YOU CANT GET IN ULDUAR ZOMGZORZ LETS FIXIT NAO HAHA.
Enter QQ’ers: O NOEZ? THEY LETTING PEOPLE TRY STUFF OTHER THAN NAXX10 IF THEY ARENT IN TOPGILDS /wrist noobs noooooo
Wow, now look, Paladin tank X can now progress into Ulduar and then ToC with some diligent work. Is he getting a rusted drake? No. Is he getting tank gear off algalon? No. So what?
Anybody that feels if you didn’t get into your guild gravy train before 3.1 was released means you should languish in painful obscurity running Kara I mean Naxx wipes I mean PUGS over and over and over again just because they did it sooner should piss off and die. Good players will always rise to the top if tools are available: Blizz made them available. A shit tank in conquest gear will show up to your raid, then your punks list and then get /kicked right friggin quick.. A hard worker in conquest gear will join you for boss screenshots and you should STFU about it.
Oh, and btw: The tiered badge system was a mistake in the first place. Justice from Kara at the end of BC could get you sunwell gear if you put in the time, just not the absolute cream of the crop. Why is all this QQ’ing happening now about … basically.. the same thing?
I have three sentences for all you egotistical, selfish elitist bastards:
Shut. The Fuck. Up.
I just wanted to say that I’m not an elite or think myself as being one, I used to play all the time, I was online all the time but ever since this new patch came out I did feel betrayed by blizzard, sadly took me months of saving emblems of conquest ” A TOTAL WASTE OF TIME ” and over 5k on repairs to get my helm, so new level 80′s can farm heroics and get the same helm I’m wearing ? I quit right after the new patch came out, I spend over 200 hours in Ulduar trying to get some gear so later on would be free ? I just dont think that’s right, it doesn’t matter if I quit the T9 would probably be free too in about 3 months =) and you will al remember me… If I could just get all of those 200 hours back =)… what a waste
Fortunetly for me , my achivements and gear
are from sunwell and arena season 3
my sunwell bow, spear, armor , and s3 shoulders
“look cool”
unlike most gear from wotlk, tier6, sunwell gear, and s3/s4 pvp gear
is very asthetically pleasing, same with the amani war bear
also helpfull when leveling 70-80
– i am an elitist jerk
-
but i havnt played wow since january of 2009 due to employment issues.
i plan to return , i do have 5 , 80′s , 3 of wich were bis main and offspec when i quit.
I just want to come back to sit in orgrimar on my amani war bear
sporting my sunwell/pvp/spear/bow and being a pimp daddy
orc hunters ftw
lol im just messing , but that is my first plan
second plan is to upgrade from my tier 7.5 crap to the new easy 8.5 , then to 9.5 , then t10 etc
i dont have as much time to play anymore but until school starts i can still squeeze about 73 hrs in a week. nothing compared to my 6 year of 120+ hours but whatever im only gonna focus on 2 chars now.
instead of 5 lol
i do want a tauren paladin and orc warlock once cataclysm hits tho so 0.0
hmm i forget what i was wranting about but im also gonna try farm 200,000 g by next year in addition to maxxing out my pvp and pve gear on hunter/mage
i wish you all good luck, just master your class, pve and pvp
and have fun
dont forget to piss off your entire faction and surpass nearly everyone without even utilizing a guild , figure that one out
sigh i cant help but brag i went from pheasant to world leader with help from no one , then again 120+ hrs a week leaves you lot of options , and gold
have a good day ladies and gents and good luck in your endevours
lmao i forget to mention back at level 70 i had over 16,000 unbuffed hp , because i stacked massive ammounts of stamina
and used a soul cleaver to BM enrage melee people to death
very awesome lol
im suprised no one is qqing about getting mounts at 20, epic mounts at 40, flying 60 etc…
or faster leveling..
or how about recruit a friend , poof insta 60
you cry about raiding and putting in effort
how about someone going 1-80 in a week or less
and THEN farming BADGES
lol
yea its bs but whatever, just stay cutting edge pve and pvp and youll still be ok!
hey guys im here to explain a few things to you, or at least provide some insight.
i’ve read a lot of your ideas about people who raid just for gear and not the ‘fun of it all’.
I am one of those people who raid just for the gear.
please dont be to judgmental.
I come prepared, on time, get along with my fellow raidmates.
bring consumables, etc
I work countless hours on my toons and am usually overgeared.
one reason gear is so important, is because every upgrade is a feather in your hat so to speak, it helps you get that next item, until you finally reach best in slot.
to be more to the point. some players
like to have the best of the best gear
for pvp and pve.
and its not what you might think.
sure resilience gear helps a lot in arena and if spec’d properly it can be fun to for bgs’
what some people do , tho,
is enjoy playing bg’s on ranged dps with the best pve gear in game, minus an adjusted hit rating for pvp…
how this works is simple, you stay the fuck away from rogues lawl. jk
stay ranged, hidden, nuke the fuck out of poeple in seconds.
use those cool haste trinkets or whatever
this is why a lot of people want gear, they miss the old days pre-resilience and they want to blow people up in pvp
you can even set up out fitter to switch between pve and pvp gear
if people really focusing you hard , go for resilence
if no ones touchin you , feel free to nuke them with your tier gear or whatever.
this is one way to gain massive ammounts of honor.
i recall a game on my boomkin in 4pc valor where i got more honor than the alliance, and they won that game.
and no it was not cause i did not help my team , that pug blew hard. if anything i helped us have a chance lol
anyways just thought id clear that up some people still like to pvp in pve gear and can do it pretty well [ im refereing to bg’s not arena’ and no i have not tried rated bgs yet, i bet resil gear melees n shit is good lol’
i had 74,000 hks on my hunter in TBC , i barely gained any in wotlk , maybe up to 78,000 now , but my point is still valid
i have to many toons i plan to focus on just one or two now, and yea im gonna get my 100k hk’s achieve soon
oh yea and the pvp in pve gear thing was a lot cooler before the fucked up AP / POM / PYROBLAST
lol
back at 70 i could do ,Arcane power + a slow cast pyroblast hidin in a bush, and them bam pom insta pyroblast
for like 8-9k , 8-9k, back to back and make that paladin go dead now. lol and that was just in crappy crafted gear
yet alone how pimp it was when i geared up in hyjal/bt/sunwell non tier pieces, i had like 48% crit rate as arcane lawl ,
yea arcane barrage at 70 was pimp shit , 2 shot poeple and just blink around lawl
sigh, i miss level 70
i had good pvp and pve gear
sunwell gear was the pimp shit man and only 1% of population had it
you think your whining over little ulduar badges , man shit you dont even know! lol
losing your sunwell elitism to lvl 80 blues , now thats lamesauce
shoulda kept it at 70 for like 2-3 more years, and no new content
lololololo
just rape face in bgs for couple year, sounds fine to me !
but noooo …
i never got naxx gear at level 60 , so sunwell was best i done
i duno which is better probably naxx acually cause no resil yet.
sunwell still pimp tho
sorry for spam
wow has been my life for long time
i got cut off for 6 months, spend about 8,000 usd on drugs/alcohol trying to soothe the pain
lol
now i finally got a new job , working to pay off debt and can finally afford broadband internet again!
sadly it does not install for 2 more days, and i got two long work shifts tomarow and next day
so yea… i rant here
lol suckars!
maybe in 2-3 year , i be debt free, finish my degree, and can build cheap new computer for cataclysm
maybe one day i work for blizzard, addiction to the ecrack mightas well help peddle it L:P